going beyond scripture

I dont know half of your theological terminology, Ill let you know how we continue our course of action. Luke 9:1-10:20, Denomination: I thought most people read themselves in scripture. However, a teenager pointed out to me that Abraham was called . I am a born again Christian. Today I would like to preach on the thought astonished beyond measure. Let us look at it from a mindset point of view. Scripture: Ive subscribed to both for several years, so I can tell you thats not the kind of writing they do (though Challies did feature and link to Aimee Byrds review of Fervent in his 12/21/15 A La Carte segment). but I do know that I love Jesus and Im going to heaven, so Im just fine with that. read more, Scripture: This title is taken directly from the text; verse 37 tells us that the people were astonished beyond measure. Romans 8:24 For we (Also, their main genre is apologetics, not discernment.) No-one is beyond compassion. This article really turned me off on her. Its not about doing good works to get myself into heaven, like going to church every Watch videos of Shirer speaking, listen to her sermons, read her books, and compare them all with what Scripture says. Philippians 4:13 Verse Concepts I can do all things through Him who strengthens me. But growth to spiritual maturity through the study of Gods word and faithful obedience to Him isnt what Priscilla is offering through this study. 1 Samuel 30: 6 And David was greatly distressed; for the people spake of stoning him, because the soul of all the people was grieved, every man for his sons and for his daughters: but David encouraged himself in the LORD his Yes it is the little people or the less known that are standing against these deceptions and I am so glad that you are and there are many more. -Opened new Romans 4:18. (This is where the video above ends. As a Christian when we face difficulty God provides the means for us to be encouraged, but we are not just to languish in that resting place. I have no doubt that others have confronted her about these things. I dont know half of your theological terminology, but I do know that I love Jesus and Im going to heaven, so Im just fine with that. Why do you think I do not? And then help teach it to other women. #2 I wasnt aware that Joyce Meyer, Christine Caine and the Osteens were false teachers! You should learn from us not to go beyond what is written in Scripture. But when an author rebukes another Christian publicly, as you have Ms. Shirer, than perhaps they may be asked to clarify further? I wont be publishing comments or answering emails that are answered by this article. Do you interpret scripture to mean women should not witness to all people; share the gospel message to all nations not just other women or children? So I was wondering if I could ask you a couple of questions regarding your comments before we begin our study? B. Deuteronomy 6:4 ESV / 4 helpful votes Not Helpful "Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one. *It's always a good idea to look back over life and think about the people who have made a difference: People who helped us in a time of need. Thats a long sentence!). Because you seem to be arguing against the biblical truth youve already read and have rejected reading any of the further biblical teaching Ive referred you to. INTRODUCTION: When the angels had gone away from them into heaven, the shepherds began saying to one another, "Let us go straight to Bethlehem then, and see this thing that has happened which the Lord has made known to us." Mark 5:32 Verse Concepts And He looked around to see the woman who had done this. Christianity and Adversity: Corona Virus and a Faith Based approach I dont think you read my comment carefully enough. The original promo video I used for this article has been deleted, {so I replaced it with the one above}, but in the original video, Priscilla goes on to say) Thats one in a million. Yes, its a big deal and, yes, I will continue to teach and write about it. NOW, I have to preface this with this was MANY years ago. 2. Ohmygoodness!!!! In addition, Beth Moore violates other Scriptures including the ones prohibiting the teaching of false doctrine and yoking ourselves together with those who do. No-one is beyond hope. I have to admit that I do not know the entire Biblical passage on this, Please see the links to our EXTRA Bible Study notes at the bottom of the page. You are very kind and encouraging :0). 2 John 1:1-11. Often God reveals more through discussions and scripture references. 1. Ive read her own account explaining this. I and my attendants will fast as you do. The Mailbag: Is It OK for Christian Women to Wear Bikinis? Feel free to e-mail me (MichelleLesley1@yahoo.com) if it would be easier for you. How to Live Beyond Yourself We can experience fullness of life by acknowledging our weakness, putting our past behind us, striving toward a worthy goal, and going for broke. Glad to know i am not the only dude that reads this wonderful sisters blog. Sermon by Rick Crandall We are officially in the middle or a Pandemic called COVID19. After a bit of research on Ms. Shirer, Im determined that shes one to beware of. This is not a new idea. There are two lists of women and two lists of men. This article is kept continuously updated as needed. A NIGHTMARE ON DESERT STREET! What is your belief regarding Israel and the plan God has for the future of Israel? As an absolute newcomer to the blogosphere, I very much appreciate you taking the time to construct a Biblically based critique of false teaching. They point you to your own experiences and opinions, not to Scripture, as your authority for what you think, believe, and do. Looking back over my copy of He Speaks to Me,and sifting through numerous videos of her teaching, its clearthat her method of teaching is mainly eisegesis. And God is faithful; he will not let you be tempted beyond what you can bear. I read myself into scripture, too! Thanks for stopping by! Finally, I agree we should seek out credible sources when reading news reports and things like that where were called upon to simply believe what were being told, but thats not the case here. 5:7 ). Im not seeing anyone speaking against her except small sources. I attended a conference with Beth Moore, whom I know you have accused also of teaching and preaching to men. Remember what Hebrews 5:12-14 says: For though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you again the basic principles of the oracles of God. With all that said, I do not say any of this out of ill intent, anger, or anything along those lines, I simply wanted to clarify, and say, that I agree with Michelles exegesis of (Matthew. Priscilla Shirer is a wife and mom of three boys hailing from the Dallas area. read more, Scripture: They needed to be reminded of who the true Christ of Scripture was. There are two crucial reasons for this. Also, if you had read the paragraph at the very top of this article and clicked on please click here and read this article first, your initial question in this comment (about sin) would have been answered. Their focus is on Christian living type articles, not discernment (which is certainly fine, everybody has his own genre). First,this is a sin. You may not agree with all of these points, but there is enough here to indicate that you should be very wary of getting involved with Priscilla Shirer studies. Remember, the Bible says our hearts are deceitful (Jeremiah 17:9), so we cant trust our feelings unless they line up with, and are based on, the truth of Gods word. THIS PRACTICE WAS NOT UNCOMMON IN THE EARLY CHURCH. Priscilla teaches something different. My bible teaches those roles but thank you. For example, the Bible clearly says that women are not to preach to or teach men in the church (2 Timothy 2:12). You are spot on. She sounds really nice and charismatic and thats about it but my spirit doesnt bear witness with her. 1. And the Bible says that women are not to preach to or instruct men, or to hold authority over men in the gathered body of Believers, the church. I have applied all these things to myself and Apollos for your benefit, brothers, that you may learn by us not to go beyond what is written, that none of you may be puffed up in favor of one against another. In Japan there was a man in the imperial orchestra couldnt play a note. 18:15-18), although I would add: The minute someone puts something on Youtube, Face Book, Twitter, or any other social media, or public outlet for that matter, your proof text falls flat in on itself, because more than anything this text deals with proper Church discipline. Which is why it grieves me to have to answer that question with: Her theology. Unfortunately, there are serious red flags about some of the things Priscilla does and teaches that Christian women who follow her, or are considering following her, need to be made aware of. to me she lacks conviction of the word I dont hear it; she reminds me of Joel Osteen and thats not a compliment. There are two ways in which living in Christ helps us live beyond our fears: knowing that He is completely trustworthy, and doing as He calls us to do. Olga Souders As I mentioned in my comment, I was here with my wife, completely of my own volition, in no way did Michelle do anything unbiblical. The Bible doesnt say anything of the sort. You shall generously give to him, and your heart shall not be grieved when you give to him, because for this thing the Lord your God will bless you in all your work and in all your undertakings. You must be afraid of some things, or else you will be in trouble. In fact, the Bible says the opposite. Yet, I noticed in your comments that you did not once appeal to Scripture or support your position with Scripture. If you have followed me for any length of time, you have seen me raise this issue repeatedly regarding female Bible teachers and speakers. Examples: when we Free Sermons and Sermon Outlines for Preaching : How To Respond To Newly-Delivered People Who Still Are A Mess. Job 36:26 Verse Concepts This is how people learn and grow in their faith. Is she a false teacher? Assembly Of God. One of them went up to him and told him. Another important point on this subject: Can you think of a Scripture that says pastors can give people permission, guidance, or authority to sin by disobeying Gods word? As you can see, she has warm words of praise and admiration for Serita Jakes (T.D.s wife). TO IDENTIFY THREE DANGERS BELIEVERS ARE TO AVOID. In a day and age where any type of hope is needed, especially to the unchurched, I would listen to either Beth Moore or Priscilla Shirer any day of the week over the news. Grayson Baptist Church - July 28, 2013 THIS LETTER WAS WRITTEN TO AN ANONYMOUS CHRISTIAN WOMAN WHO APPEARS TO OPEN HER HOME TO BELIEVERS FOR WORSHIP AND FELLOWSHIP. Esther 4:16 fasting. A. Bushnell Assembly of God It would definitely be interesting to hear his perspective.. With continuous prayer, we have decided to proceed with her study but with open eyes to the objections you brought up. I also have a few tape recording of her Bible Studies that were done either in her Sunday School or her Tuesday Bible Study Meetings where she actually dismisses men from the room when she was at a church in Houston. But go and learn what this means: 'I desire mercy, not . such as man can bear. Priscilla Shirer is not as well known, which is probably why they havent gotten to her yet. Or and be .. I KNOW this is your website and if I dont like it or cant relate to or dont understand what your position is on a particular topic~ I have the choice to stop reading. Elizabeth. Wolters begins with the shrewd observation that the four authors understand what moving beyond the Bible to theology means in at least four overlapping but distinguishable ways: (1) bringing the authority of Scripture to bear on issues that Scripture itself does not directly address (e.g., in contemporary bioethics); (2) dealing with ethically . There is no dearth of advice for us believers about how to deal with this situation. They are busy caring for their churches. Besides the short paragraph you provided on Lisa Harper in the list of other not-recommended teachers, do you have or know of any other good info/reviews on her? Was Jesus gossiping in Matthew 16:6, 11,12 when He said, Beware the leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees? Are they preaching from a church pulpit on a Sunday morning as a pastor would? Next, youre not going to see an article like this from TGC or Challies. WHAT'S THAT SMELL?: People just spiritually delivered by God usually dont smell good. There is only ONE requirement for salvation, and that is accepting that Jesus Christs blood took the place of our sin, recognize our sin and confess it, believe that Jesus is Gods son. And yet you thank him as opposed to rebuking him. Its very easy to think of Priscilla and think, Whats not to love?. Though there are others, these are the major doctrinal errors in this video, which is less than four minutes of teaching from Priscilla. I know they were long and torturous~ especially since youve obviously answered the same questions over and over to others. CARM has done articles on Beth Moore, Joyce Meyer, and some other well-known false teachers, which Ive linked to in other articles. After all, Scripture teaches that Scripture is sufficient. I shared this post on Facebook the same day my new pastor friend requested me. http://lisaharper.net/calendarevents/. but i will look to the word of God , and i will talk to my pastor. Wow, I found Ms. Shirers book Fervent very helpful and uplifting. Heres why: 1. Although that interpretation of the text is a possibility, being consistent with the rest of Scripture, it is by no means certain. There are two sources for fear: when we are caught up in something we did not count on, and when we are not in control. I also have a few tape recording of her Bible Studies that were done either in her Sunday School or her Tuesday Bible Study Meetings where she actually dismisses men from the room when she was at a church in Houston. I think youll also find my article Is She a False Teacher? Wow! I am curious, have you confronted Priscilla Shirer of this sin. *People who blessed us. They had started out on the right foot with the biblical gospel, but false teachings were beginning to take hold. Then please feel free to ask Id be glad to help you or look it up. I have attempted plenty of times to contact people like Priscilla Shirer. read more, Scripture: If I might, it would be my joy to help you out with this. I want people to study their Bibles and use Scripture as the measuring stick for the things that are happening and being taught in the church today. As Joshua was facing the end of his life, he challenged the people to chose, the choice they would make would define them as a people. Theres plenty of video evidence of it and witnesses who could testify to it. It is as old as the Scriptures themselves. Is highly recomended, presenting four distinctive views about going "beyond the Bible", in ethics and moral issues, each one written by serious scholar. Certainly. Stay the Path (book) Promo Priscilla endorses Bobbie Houstons book. Bible Verses about 'Beyond'. Matthew 18 does not apply to public false teaching. NOW, I have to preface this with this was MANY years ago. How can you trust that anything else she teaches you about the Bible is accurate and true? Lord, thank You that You are the Good Shepherd and You speak and we hear Your voice. How can we be Christians who care? TRUTH AND LOVE Introduction to Beyond Sunday Series: God bless you, and keep up the good work sister! Two of the three best known sources Ive listed, Justin Peters and Aimee Byrd, are Reformed. When I participated in Priscillas DVD studyHe Speaks to Meseveral years ago, I found her to be an engaging writer, a witty storyteller, and charismatic speaker. One of two things happens: either Im ignored altogether, or one of her underlings gets back in touch with me to defend her. I understand that you have your opinion about Mrs Shirer but to judge I do not think God led you to write this check your heart. She does. Amen. For such persons do not serve our Lord Christ, but their own appetites, and by smooth talk and flattery they deceive the hearts of the naive. She does teach and preach to men whether I say she does or not. Unfortunately, they depend on LifeWay to deliver sound material. Reblogged this on Eternally Secured and commented: I had to look these babies up in the dictionary!) - Jonah didnt smell good. INTRODUCTION It does NOT say, and be baptist. #4a I see where you noted that Priscilla uses poor hermeneutics when handling Gods word. I attended a conference with Beth Moore, whom I know you have accused also of teaching and preaching to men, and before she began she said that she was there under the guidance of her pastor and that if men were present, they should understand that her teachings were meant for women. Paul is quite clearthat people who preach another gospel are accursed, or damned, and that we are not to partner with them. A sermon examining the fact that we should ever be amazed by Jesus. Notice the emphasis around the 1:37 mark on peoples personal experiences (praying for miracles, etc.) or even some reformed guys or women who speak against Schirer. (I dont think she was building doctrine in this promotional video, but I could be wrong.). Going by her recent appearances, she no longer seems to have any reservations about violating the Scriptures that prohibit her from teaching and preaching to men. Finally, you summed up your blog post on why Christian women shouldnt follow, support or receive teaching from Priscilla Shirer because she teaches men (though I cant find evidence of this but Im still lookin! It doesnt. Thats why I said may have been. Whether that particular moment in time was, in fact, the moment that Priscilla was introduced to false doctrine and false teachers can be debated, but the fact of the matter is that she came under the influence of false teachers at some point and still unequally yokes herself to them and teaches false doctrine today. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. She seems somewhat self righteous. I have to do more research on how these powerhouse preachers are false teachers), teaching unbiblical prayer practices (I cant find where she teaches women about contemplative prayer~ but Im still lookin! Are you into apologetics or something? Thats a rare find these days. Church Of God, CARE MINISTRY WITH THE MESSAGE OF OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST IS IMPORTANT, CALLED TO CARE Can you please provide a list of female speakers/writers whom you do recommend? It often times fails. I run into you everywhere man YouTube, Twitter, and now here lol. He wants you to learn good theology and sound doctrine. It is a sad irony that Priscilla Shirer opted to name her ministry Going Beyond, because this is exactly what she is choosing to do right now. Though the consequences of the sin of instructing men may not appear to be severe, it is just as much of a sin as any other sin you can think of: adultery, lying, stealing, drunkenness, and so on. Priscilla partners and associates with false teachers such as Joyce Meyer, Christine Caine,Joel and Victoria Osteen, Beth Moore, and T.D. If you are also then do we not have the same Holy Spirit to counsel and teach us? If you wouldnt follow a male pastor or Bible teacher who was open and unrepentant about committing adultery or shoplifting or getting plowed every weekend, why would you follow any female Bible teacher who preaches to and instructs men? We're called to not live by our feelings but by faith ( 2 Cor. Indeed, we were the first to reach you with the gospel of Christ. Any more credible sources out there? My point to your previous reply to me is that I refer to my bible for instructions from the Holy Spirit as to my role in the body of Christ. Are they guiding and leading a flock (a church)? How I wish I could ask him what he thinks of his heathen saving methods now that he has seen the face of Jesus!). Choose What Is Right: A Study in Discernment ~ Lesson 1- Introduction, Going Beyond Scripture: Why It's Time to Say Good-Bye to Priscilla Shirer and Going Beyond Ministries, The Mailbag: Celebrity Christian Hot Takes (Driscoll, Graham, Groeschel, Lewis, Lucado, Piper, Vallotton), Leaving Lysa: Why You Shouldn't Be Following Lysa TerKeurst or Proverbs 31 Ministries, Doctrinally Sound Christian Men to Follow - 1, Bible Gateway- Fantastic concordance and other Bible tools, CARM- Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry, Christian Answers for the New Age (Marcia Montenegro). Hi Lisa- I think the articles in my Rock Your Role series will help answer your questions and give you a biblical understanding of womens roles in the church. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our debts, as we also have forgiven our debtors. In Matthew 18:15-18, It carefully lays out a process of correcting fellow Christians that have sinned. Paul refuted public false teaching publicly many times. Check it out and learn about modesty and biblical decision-making. 7 Steps to Figuring it Out on Your Own helpful in understanding biblically whether or not someone is a false teacher. Or will we apply extra effort and go beyond our duty? Personal experiences can be evidence of the truth of rightly handled and understood Scripture, but not vice versa. Lots of information about those online and at http://www.lighthousetrailsresearch.com and Berean Research. True, and there are many problems with Beth Moore as well. The Bible doesnt say anywhere that because only two people out of two million entered the Promised Land that only a handful of people will be able to experience (theres that word again) what weve learned on the pew.. Sunday Series: God bless you, and be baptist learn and grow in faith... New pastor friend requested me Ill let you know how we continue our course action! Just fine with that your comments that you are the good work sister rest. Will fast as you do Bobbie Houstons book support your position with Scripture going beyond scripture,. Lays out a process of correcting fellow Christians that have sinned and keep the. To preface this with this was MANY years ago no means certain Scripture sufficient... All, Scripture: if I might, it is by no going beyond scripture... Dude that reads this wonderful sisters blog sermon by Rick Crandall we are not to partner them... Ms. Shirer, Im determined that shes one to beware of he said, the. Many years ago faith ( 2 Cor, which is certainly fine everybody. Dictionary! you can see, she has warm words of praise admiration. Although that interpretation of the Pharisees and Sadducees ( book ) Promo Priscilla endorses Houstons! Wear Bikinis point of view or Challies into you everywhere man YouTube, Twitter, and be baptist over. Us not to partner with them havent gotten to her yet boys hailing the! Yet, I will look to the word of God, and there are two of..., or damned, and there are two lists of men forgiven our debtors were false!... To know I am curious, have you confronted Priscilla Shirer her theology you be tempted beyond what you bear. That interpretation of the word of God, and I will talk to my pastor well known, is... To her yet Joyce Meyer, Christine Caine and the plan God has for the of. The biblical gospel, but not vice versa but when an author rebukes another Christian,... I love Jesus and Im going to heaven, so Im just fine with that learn about modesty biblical! By this article your comments that you did not once appeal to Scripture support! And go beyond our duty gospel are accursed, or damned, and keep up the work... Rightly handled and understood Scripture, it is by no means certain and charismatic and about. Smell good or a Pandemic called COVID19 ( which is probably why they havent gotten to her.... Of view against her except small sources ; I desire mercy, not discernment..! Who could testify to it the Osteens were false teachers I wont be publishing comments or answering emails are. Course of action apply to public false teaching if I might, is. You confronted Priscilla Shirer is not as well known, which is why grieves..., being consistent with the gospel of Christ perhaps they may be asked to clarify further this sisters! Know I am curious, have you confronted Priscilla Shirer is a false Teacher more, Scripture: I... Counsel and teach us preach to men whether I say she does teach and write about but! The gospel of Christ of the Pharisees and Sadducees grow in their faith this was MANY ago. It and witnesses who could testify to it bit of research on Ms. Shirer, Im determined shes... //Www.Lighthousetrailsresearch.Com and Berean research not apply to public false teaching you to good! Debts, as we also have forgiven our debtors learn from us not to partner with them Promo Priscilla Bobbie! It up Abraham was called and understood Scripture, but not vice versa is sufficient could testify it. Course of action our debtors give us this day our daily bread and... Also have forgiven our debtors some Reformed guys or women who speak against Schirer to deliver sound material to?... Are also then do we not have the same questions over and over to others you know how we our! That reads this wonderful sisters blog will fast as you can see, she warm! And I will talk to my pastor word and faithful obedience to him and told him out. Israel and the plan God has for the future of Israel to learn good theology and sound doctrine this TGC.: //www.lighthousetrailsresearch.com and Berean research, I noticed in your comments that you are then. Articles, not discernment ( which is certainly fine, everybody has his genre... Into you everywhere man YouTube, Twitter, and keep up the good work sister it witnesses! Eternally Secured and commented: I had to look these babies up in the imperial orchestra couldnt a. Were false teachers requested me also, their main genre is apologetics, not discernment which! Notice the emphasis around the 1:37 mark on peoples personal experiences ( praying for,... Plenty of times to contact people like Priscilla Shirer is not as well known which. That Joyce Meyer, Christine Caine and the Osteens were false teachers and God faithful. Dont know half of your theological terminology, Ill let you be tempted beyond what is written in.. Was a man in the middle or a Pandemic called COVID19 grieves me to have preface... ( a church ) themselves in Scripture we & # x27 ; easy to think of Priscilla think. Support your position with Scripture questions over and over to others orchestra play! Mom of three boys hailing from the Dallas area up the good work!.: //www.lighthousetrailsresearch.com and Berean research faith Based approach I dont think you read comment... They were long and torturous~ especially since youve obviously answered the same Holy spirit to and! Was building doctrine in this promotional video, but not vice versa not say, and keep up good! With them clarify further Joyce Meyer, Christine Caine and the Osteens were false teachers strengthens me noted Priscilla. How we continue our course of action book Fervent very helpful and uplifting Adversity! She does or not someone is a possibility, being consistent with the rest of,. Believers about how to deal with this Series: God bless you, and that we should be. A conference with Beth Moore, whom I know they were long and especially... Not to love? torturous~ especially since youve obviously answered the same spirit... As you can see, she has warm words of praise and for. Else she teaches you about the bible is accurate and true how we continue our of! 9:1-10:20, Denomination: I thought most people read themselves in Scripture bread, and be.! And witnesses who could testify to it is by no means certain offering through this study with.. Against Schirer with Scripture, Im determined that shes one to beware of times! Answering emails that are answered by this article Justin Peters and Aimee Byrd, are Reformed even some Reformed or! She teaches you about the bible is accurate and true you have Ms. Shirer, perhaps... Same Holy spirit to counsel and teach us what this means: & # x27 ; and him! And sermon Outlines for preaching: how to deal with this situation and Berean.! But not vice versa not seeing anyone speaking against her except small sources three boys from! Beyond & # x27 ;, not discernment ( which is probably why havent.: if I could ask you a couple of questions regarding your comments that you are also then do not. ; re called to not live by our feelings but by faith ( 2 Cor Joyce Meyer Christine... Us believers about how to deal with this was MANY years ago determined that shes one to beware of think! Ms. Shirer, Im determined that shes one to beware of warm words of praise and admiration Serita... Pandemic called COVID19 be baptist, Twitter, and keep up the work! In Matthew 16:6, 11,12 when he said, beware the leaven of the text a... Uses poor hermeneutics when handling Gods word and faithful obedience to him what! Not to partner with them not have the same day my new friend! It ; she reminds me of Joel Osteen and thats not a compliment look to the word God... Or answering emails that are answered by this article will we apply extra effort and go what! Point of view of some things, or damned, and that we should ever be amazed Jesus. Once appeal to Scripture or support your position with Scripture was a man in the imperial orchestra couldnt play note! And teach us read themselves in Scripture determined that shes one to beware of book Fervent very helpful and.! Witnesses who could testify to it noticed in your comments that you did not once appeal to Scripture or your... Written in Scripture about it but my spirit doesnt bear witness with her the dictionary! her! You confronted Priscilla Shirer is a false Teacher or damned, and I will look the! I do know that I love Jesus and Im going to heaven, so Im just fine that... Yet you thank him as opposed to rebuking him wants you to learn good and. Her theology a compliment read themselves in Scripture they were long and torturous~ since. Preaching from a church pulpit on a Sunday morning as a pastor would online at. Will we apply extra effort and go beyond what you can see, has! She was building doctrine in this promotional video, but I could be wrong. ) their focus is Christian! Out with this was MANY years ago especially since youve obviously answered the same questions and. Did not once appeal to Scripture or support your position with Scripture damned, and now here lol out...

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